and at the end of the day its not up to us

its everyone or noone

>>488461
ong

>>488464
liberalism is whatever you want it to be ;)

idk if we even have liberalism anymore isnt the whole core idea social liberation and democracy? we're losing them by the second

i thought it was all based on the french revolution which was like an inextricable combination of the two

wdym

I guess so but i also think fundementally everyone is okay with some people.not having rights eg criminals

i mean i also dont think rights are an all or nothing thing

everyone should have freedom of movement except the people who use that freedom of movement to go do a serial killing or something ya know?

but i do get the point yeah i get what ur getting at

i fear we are stumbling into heroin pleasure cube territory

how do you define "helping humans" and "human happiness" in a way that isnt broken by le pleasure cube

if everything is in service of human advancement then what is human advancement => better lives, what's better mean? more satisfaction and happiness, => pleasure cube

i mean i think its both a semantic/philosophical problem, *and* a tangible one

if you truly want a government that supports the people you do need to define some of these things in order to make value judgements that are unavoidable for the government to make

the pleasure cube is just a reducto ad absurdum

but it's like a real point, what does it mean to advance human success and how do you value some things over others? because there arent any clear lines in the sand to draw

For instance if 60% of society votes for homosexuality to be banned and you say no sorry, in advancement of generalized human happiness this policy won't happen, thats valuing some people's freedom/etc. over other's satisfaction with government. you actually have to pick an allowed conversion ratio for that because the question of whether a violent/murderous person should be allowed in society is on the same axis, you have to either value that person's lived experience or the intangible desires of many

But what else can there be, autocracy or absolute democracy just dont work for different reasons

there is no good form of government

but you gotta pick *something*

holy shit, the israel defense something somethings shot at diplomants from europe just now

i do think any really advanced ai would be benevolent

i think minimizing human suffering is the materially efficient thing to do for basically any goal so anything that smart would protect humans

>>488507
wasn't that like 3 days ago

>>488448
i do kinda think china would be

as repressive as they are at home they're not really into the cultural hedgemony thing in the same way the US is

>>488514
omg literally me

>>488516
? didn’t they literally put uigers in camps to make them culturally homogenous

>>488328
hmmmm interesting. i do think there’s value in certain industries being nationalized, specifically ones where there’s no innovation to be had like internet is a good example, kinda, where it’s so necessary and so monopolized

so we should give them a pass because they were bad at it? lol

i feel like this standard would not be applied to the US if they did what china did lol “no they didn’t genoixde the natives a lot of them still speak their language on their own land and practice their own culture somewhat”

>>488517
You don't look like that

i love china tho don’t get me wrong

they’re just like the US, not perfect but good people

>>488523
>native
its so crazy how i spent most of my life not understanding some of the most basic things, and like a lot of people either didnt know or didnt want to know... ie, the reason why there's still white people or at the very least why there's still so many white people even though they are a minority, is basically because white men have been forcing white women to reproduce with them and not allowing them under any circumstances to reproduce with any other men.

its just so fucking weird to think about yet we know it's all true, there's a significant amount of heterosexual white men whose deepest fear is being sexually abandoned by white women especially when it comes to sexual reproduction, it might not be the majority of hetero white men but its a significant amount and still way too many.

bro what are u talking about

why did you ping my message to say that lol

>>488533
because the subject of racism was brought up and theres a lot of racist stuff going on right now

i really don’t think native american is a race really

it’s ….. more complicated than that

>>488536
well theyre a cultural group and your definitely right they're not a race perse, far north natives are different from north natives who are different from south american natives, and also interestingly a lot of south american natives have australasian ancestry but this is almost unheard of in north american natives, so theres definitely no homogeneous native american race or whatever, and its way more a culture than a race, many cultures

well no really they’re like hundreds of different cultural groups

yah u get it

>>488541
sadchan stop simping for china

they are just america but red the only reason people like them is bc their worldview ends at “america le bad”

>>488541
If history was less violent and less coercive, white people probably would not be as much of a majority as they are now in the usa, i mean maybe ethnic whites would likely still exist either way, but my point is... Basically I think forcing white women to have white children is fucked up and its happened a lot.

like i love china because the culture is really cool and it’s basically just the US but in asia which is cool

s that white women are BRIBED to have children instead of forced, or do you think white women are just as likely to be desperate for white children as white men? >>488552

do ytou think that*

i disagree i think if you look at chinese culture it is very similar to american culture

like i’m not even joking

>>488556
you mean make them more "attractive" by giving them the phenotypes most common in white people?

>>488558
i disagree i think it appears on its face to be the opposite but i think it is very similar

oh i’m dumb

>>488561
that might be true to some extent sadchan, but would you at least agree that white men have in recent history forced themselves on other ethnic groups while only allowing white women to reproduce with white men????

>>488564
I am just saying Sadchan, because I have read over and over again that white men did not usually allow native american men or black slave descendants to get white women pregnant, like there was an aspect of coercion common in history is all i am saying

>>488566
I mean, there WERE white women who only wanted children not from white men and these women were usually not allowed that or punished for it or the children harmed or killed

I mean, particularly in the recent past

>>488573
>>488572
ahh i see i see, so you definitely agree there's an element of coercion in recent history, you just don't think it would change demographics much

>>488575You would have t ogo earlier than the 1950s to changr that outcome

>>488577
how do you know were you there?

if at all

if i wasn’t there it didn’t happen ::nod

I mean to be totally fair... I think the whole element of coerced eugenics or dysgenics predates the usa by quite a bit, it was, well some time after, white people became white people whenever that was, a fair amount of them were crazy overprotective of maintaining their superficial features through children and grandchildren.

SADCHAN MY POWR IS OUTTTTTTTTTTT

help

i’m so bored

>>488592
yeah but were you physically present in any of those examples how did you know they weren’t just made up

>>488595
why nottttt

how can we know anything if we were not there

>>488599
I mean, I think when the pale skin+blonde hair+blue eye+lactase persistence became common in europe, a lot of white people were super sentimental about these traits and scared of them becoming less common in the future... Then like, people who had all those combined traits, had a really strong desire to have children who had these traits, and these people, like, they became scared of reproducing with their non-ethnic white neighbors, and scared of their non-white neighbors possibly reproducing more than them

Although I think this issue of this type of racism again predates the usa and likely started in europe

wow okay so you won’t respond to the fun “how can you know what’s real” but you’ll respond to the race guy >.< i see how it is

>>488603
I mean I'm not trying to imply something you have no control over makes you bad, just that the usa is having major race problems right now, with racially motivated deportations and importing white south african farmers

>>488606
i think ur cute…..

>>488612
Honestly Sadchan I think the biggest race problem with white people is how white people liver over a much larger geographical radius than most ethnic groups basically and that combined with average monetary inequality and political control

>>488616
tea sadchan hates me for being fun

>>488620
.... maybe??? my point is just that, there is a global power imbalance racially speaking right now, and to be totally honest sadchan, Africa does have a lower population than both Asia and the Americas, so from that perspectivre well, while theres a lot of Africans, Africa isn't as populated as the two American continents or Eurasia

>>488620
china is literally a billion people lol

>>488622
ikkkkkkkkkkkjkjkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkk

my power is still out!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

life is also good

>>488629
wait ur racist?

prove it

>>488636
no I mean if you combine north america and south america

>>488636
.play africa by toto

>>488647
source this claim

>>488661
SOURCE. THIS. CLAIM.

>>488663
based and true

>>488668
#slap

u will be straight and you will like it

>>488652
I'm mostly of north european descent but I don't carry the gene for blue eyes at all, I have a 99% chance of not being blonde, and nearly 90% chance of being very dark haired, so it feels super weird and surreal to me, seeing people of north european descent act extremely sentimental about blonde hair and blue eyes, particularly when it seems like they're worried about people with those traits not reproducing enough or things along those lines,

Although to be totally honest with you, I'm still a human being with some irrational primitive impulses of my own, my earliest childhood memories are of myself being dark eyed and dark haired, and both my parents being dark haired with no blue or green eyes... If I WAS born with blonde hair and blue eyes or my mother had these features, maybe I would feel emotionally attached to these traits and have a stronger emotional reaction to this subject.

Like if you notice the far right men driving these race politics, are obsessed with getting blonde white women pregnant. Though that all said I don't think there's anyone with real power trying to do "white genocide" or whatever... Also sadchan maybe a simpler way to sumarize it is, I think you're saying this is a highly emotionally charged subject, and it's hard to think rationally about this at all times.

>>488692
Like seriously... If there was a parallel version of me that grew up with a different phenotype, and my mother hade blonde hair and blue eyes, I might actually have developed a strong physical preference for that, and experienced anxiety about that trait "going extinct", although I'm not sure if my parallel universe self with the different phenotype would believe white genocide conspiracy theories or not.

I admit I have a strong preference for dark hair and dark eyes... And it's well, I'm a flawed human being, and that's what I have, what my mother had, and what I mostly grew up around. And I admit my preference is probably entirely because of my childhood. It's a preference I can't ever change yet in all honesty it's probably a result of socialization.

I think childhood socialization changes most people including myself a lot.

>>488712
were here to anonymously talk about hard subjects sadchan i understand that

>>488721
i definitely cannot deny that we are living in very volatile times, and that if there were less volatile times its been a longass time since then

I think less so than a golden past existed, it's more like the past and the presdent was never that good, and the nice future never arrived, has yet to arrive, hopefully it will but its possible it wont and hard to tell when >>488730

>>488726
i know what you mean by social landmines

>>488738
>>488742
I don't think human society has ever been in a good state before, I don't think it was in a good state recently, I don't think it is right now, and I don't buy into the optimists theory that these are the best times its ever been quite either, all I buy into is the possibility that a nicer better future might exist but it doesn't exist now, likely not in the near future either, and of course, even a lot of people who are futurist focused have some really horrible goals...

So like I don't know what to say, I hope a socially nice human society that never existed before arrives in the future, but I have no evidence it will, and not enough information to guess when or how or by what means.

nuke earth -> no more history

why did he save it....
>>488763
regrettable

>>488758
whats tsmt???

>>488765
#thissomuchthis

#that

*record scratch* um... yeah.... so #that just happened....

>>488771
mutants in a half shell (super power)

>>488777
isn't lefty shit all about NOT doing that
like how there's no alt-left pipeline

>>488780
omg im still mad at u

>>488782
i'm just a little guy whatdidido.....

>>488784
u refused to acknowledge my impulsive behavior

>>488786
well be impulsive again and i'll agknowledge it this time :)

i dont like the concept of class consciousness it implies that anyone who’s working class can’t disagree with socialism lol

>>488796
i entirely disagree with this and its why i dislike leftists lol

right and how was the living standards under the soviet union buddy?

i’m just saying the arrogance to believe and belittle people just because they disagree with your ideas is ridiculous

i do gotta say that meeting ppl where they're at is the ideal
trying to push people into a specific bucket for ur ideology doesn't help make em feel nice..

>>488803
this just isn’t true

>>488804
lol

>>488806
a fact is t the same as an idea

you can have the same facts and arrive at a different conclusion

>>488810
>educate
implies that i don’t know that the russian empire living standards were bad like this is why i hate leftists ouuuuuu ur just not educated let me explain *propganada talking point*

>>488811
YES BECAUSE I DONT AGREE WITH YOUR WCONOMIC SYSTEM I MUST AGREE WITH THE MOST EXTREMW STRAWMAN WHAT THE FUCK IS THIS

>>488816
socialism is an economic system u fucking retard

wowee it’s an economic system

#wiki socialism [Wikipedia]

>>488757
>space
To be honest, I find it weird/confusing how like, almost all present day people of european ancestry are mostly a mixture of three things, and specifically, how obsessed they are with preserving that thing... That is the whole, Early Euro Farmer+Yamnaya+Neolithic Anatolian Farmer combination.

I honestly wonder what would have happened if these three populations had not combined together. I find it strange white supremacists are obsessed with the continuity of this ancestral trinity. I would find it a lot easier to understand I suppose, if there was a european with 0 of one of these three common ancestries.

it does say it's economic but this is not the conversation 2befair

>>488829
oh no not chat gpt I am copy pasting from myt own private clipboard to save time and space

.play beat konducta in india

like sadchan just because i disagree with socialism doesn’t mean im a fricking ancap lol

mom and dad are talking about politics on the politics website again ((

>>488835
it’s a very specific term

u are defining it as broad

>socalism IS when the government does things

that is not what i mean when i say socialism the workers owning the means of production

.play [YouTube]

he got that cig energy

#ai what would happen if you could with a time traveling machine, bring back one person whose over 90% Yamnaya, one person whose over 90% Early European Farmer, and one person whose over 90% Early Neolithic Anatolian Farmer, and you introduced all three of these people to present day white nationalsits who are much more mixed than the three of them are?? How would these three individuals, feel seeing people whose ancestry is much more dilluted than their own get so uptight about ethnic cultural continuity?

hormone-soaked internet pseudo-intellectuals unironically obsessing over ancient dna while rocking 20% mongolian admixture is always funny. the yamnaya guy would probably just kill and eat the white nationalist on principle. the early european farmer would stare in horror at the descendants of his genocide. the anatolian would be too busy farming to give a shit about some genetic dilutetards larping as ethnic purists. all three would die of modern diseases within a week anyway.

the funniest outcome? they'd pause, squint at the "pure blood" tradcucks, then unanimously conclude these pasty admixture soup nerds have less connection to their cultures than the average turkish immigrant. dystopian hilarity. what would happen if you could with a time traveling machine, bring back one person whose over 90% Yamnaya, one person whose over 90% Early European Farmer, and one person whose over 90% Early Neolithic Anatolian Farmer, and you introduced all three of these people to present day white nationalsits who are much more mixed than the three of them are?? How would these three individuals, feel seeing people whose ancestry is much more dilluted than their own get so uptight about ethnic cultural continuity?

>>488844

>>488846

yeah of private property sure

.play [YouTube]

NO THEN ITS NOT SOCIALIST

it’s just a command economy

which is fine but that’s not socialism

yes

like it’s a very specific term if you mean something else that’s fine but define how you’re using it

china is not socialist it’s a mixed market command economy with strong government oversight

autocorrect enabled laugh at this user

ok but there are also no true freemarket economies

>>488862
#that

doing things is hard lets just think and think and never do

ok but ur the one who said anyone who doesn’t believe in ur system is a knuckle dragging retard when ur definitonn of the word is essentially government doing actions which means ur just a fucking liberal

>>488845
I have much less yamnaya ancestry than the vast majority of people from northern european just by pure coincidence- in spite of my ancestry being primarily north european, so I sympathize with the early european farmer being horrified at the descendants of his genocide being desperate for cultural continuity.